Backup, and LTC

I don't think the way that timecode currently is implemented works well in a backup system, but perhaps I am thinking about it incorrectly.

Equipment
Roadhog fullboar 4
PC running Hog 4 pc (With LTC Widget)
DP8000

The Roadhog, and Hog PC are both running a server, and are assigned to #1.

My problem is that, I can only assign 1 timecode source to the cuelist.

So, if my main console fails, timecode cues stop being played back, until I go into my backup, and change the timecode source to the widget plugged into the pc.

Is there a way to set this up to have it work better?

Thanks,
Josh
  • Hi Joshua,

    Your solution is very simple. Connect your LTC widget to your DP8000.
    now when your FB4 fails you can run your show on the HOG4pc without making any changes.

    Don't forget to enable your LTC widget on your DP8000.

    good luck with it.

    Martin
  • That makes a bit of sense, but what do you do if the dp8000 fails? Currently I transmit artnet to redundant pathway boxes, so if one fails I can switch to the other output. I am transmitting redundant artnet from the full boar and the dp8000. Any other ideas?
    Thanks,
  • there is another way assuming that you use the DP8000 with your HOG4pc.
    connect both consoles using midi.
    this way you have a redunant controle which your main desk triggers your back up. when your maind desk fails you can switch to your back up.
  • What if the DMX Cable fails, or a fixture...
    100% redudancy is not possible in our business.

    If you want to be safe as possible, then you need 2 systems only connected via midi so that they are in the same state, but then you need to load the show manually in the backup system, also switch to that system manually and so on....

    Assigning 1 timecode-source to a list is also kind of a must, how would you handle 2 timecodes in one list. There is only one wait-time....
    Most systems I know work this way. If you really want to be very safe, build 2 identical systems, all with own networks, switches, DPs etc and then a DMX Switch where you can change from main to backup.
  • A single DMX cable or a single fixture doesn't kill the entire show.

    The timecode widget going missing can and will cause the show to come to a complete stop, until the backup can be selected as a master timecode source.

    While I agree the only way to make it completely safe is to have 2 complete independent systems, But I believe there must be something in between.
  • A single cable can kill a complete show:

    Cat cable from FoH to stage, or a broken cat cable in the dimmer city which was on the first look ok but caused switches to go from 10mbit to 100mbit to Gbit bringing the whole network into troubles.
    Or what about the first run up into a large truss... Ok you have spare cable for shure up into the truss... but this needs to be connected into the first fixture of the line...

    But for your setup, like you did:

    Connect LTC widget to the HOG-PC and set this as LTC source #2
    Make a macro to change the lists LTC source to switch from source #1 to source #2
    This is done in a second.

    In most all main-backup situations there is the "switching" moment.
  • The macro is a good idea, and I don't know why I didn't think of it.
    While I would prefer an automatic option. This would be acceptable.

    As for cable worries.
    I run separate cables from FOH to backstage, or I run a rapid spanning tree switch, which allows for multiple runs backstage, in case one fails.

    Or if that isn't possible, I will place an additional backup backstage, next to the ethernet hub. Once again, with a separate cable run.

    For The FOH truss, I never run a single DMX cable to the truss, usually 1 per type, or 8 fixtures max.

    Once again, never allowing for a single cable to kill the entire show.

    Then again, I run tours, so redundancy is key.
  • Automatic would be fine but a bit to difficult because you have to many options, like:

    * How should the console know if the timecode stopped by purpose or by accident....
    * Jumpframes
    * Rehearsal Situations where you wont the consoles to swop
    * Timecode loss from "outside" like audio/videosource crashed.
    etc etc

    So switching the source via macro would always be my choice
    It is different from switching the server where it must be seamless or otherwise you will have the console to stop working