Here it looks like "remember fader values" is absolutely broken cause they always snap to 100% when changing page. Well it's not true! I had restore activity enabled in the pages I was testing with. But yes I'm seeing the same thing: The desk always remembers fader values.
For both Hog 4 OS and Hog 3 OS this is the core rule of the remember fader values option:
If "remember fader values" is turned OFF: then when a list or scene is set to a level by a physical master and then that physical master goes away (page change) the list will not playback at that intensity level if executed from the directory. Instead it will playback at 100%
If "remember fader values" is turned ON: then when a list or scene is set to a level by a physical master and then that physical master goes away (page change) the list WILL playback at that intensity level if executed from the directory.
Now, here's where the difference is between Hog 4 OS and Hog 3 OS when "remember fader values" is turned OFF:
In Hog 3 OS the stored fader value is lost immediately once the master reappears on a playback bar. The physical position of the fader wins. (remember fader values off)
In Hog 4 OS the stored fader value is not lost. Instead the stored value is restored once the master reappears on the playback bar. The physical position of the fader moves to match the stored value. (remember fader values off)
Why the change in Hog 4 OS? Because with motorized faders we can put a playback's last known fader position right back onto the physical master to assist the user in restoring the page as it was when they left it. Since the playback is released it doesn't cause any harm to the look on stage. We feel this is a plus for users and is desired even when remember fader values is turned off. (it seems some disagree)
There debate here gets heavier when we look at this behavior as it pertains to HTP faders. When a list is set to HTP the Hog 4 OS restores the HTP's fader value (just like its LTP brothers) as well as puts it's intensity onstage when it appears on a physical master. This is problematic if the stored level of the HTP is not where the user wants the HTP fader value to be when they come to a page where the HTP fader is on a physical master. Where the user wants the value to go for an HTP master when it pops up on a page is not always the same.
The user may want one of three things to happen: 1) Restore HTP to wherever the current physical fader is set (HOG 3 OS)… not always the best thing since the physical fader may be at full 2) Restore HTP to wherever the stored fader value is (HOG 4 OS)… most consistent 3) Restore HTP to 0 to prevent the HTP from coming onstage (regardless of stored value or position of physical fader) (100% consistent and safe)
The current Hog 4 OS implementation only supports one method which is to restore HTP to wherever the stored fader value is set even when remember fader values is turned off.
I believe what I am hearing from this thread is that when "remember fader values" is turned off, the Hog 3 OS methodology is preferred despite the benefit that the motorized faders provide in the Hog 4 OS which is to always match the physical position of a fader to the stored value of the playback (even with RFV turned off)?
* You are right with that with remember fader values turned off the HOG 3 OS methodology is what most user are expecting (so do I and a lot more people)
* Main reason for that: Typical Rock´n´Roll Tour, one page per song, during focusing and rehearsals in the afternoon I run thru my list, do updates etc... Now have to make sure that I bring down all faders before my page-change, otherwise I will be the stupid one during the show when all my blinders or so go on... ;-)
or:
I left all faders on 100% for my endlook, then do the next page, but start normally with all my faders down.... Means checking this before the start of a show.
or
Put some stuff on 100%, have this also on the template, like blinders, bring it up on the template, change page, would also mean to check this before the next show
or
I need to check all pages before a show to check the values, because my I had left a fader up the night before in that song
and there are a lot more reasons
At the moment this makes me crazy... I´m so used to to the old Hog 3 way, also other people here in Germany have there problems with it. I understand that because it is released (a normal cuelist) nothing would be in the output, but often I do fade in the first cue by hand, so press go and the bringe up the fader, or activate the first cue via capture activity and than fade in manually. Now i need to check all the time the faderposition first before starting a list.
We should have options like:
Remember fader values for: * only for directory * directory and faders * faders
I'm agree with Marc. I think these new rules are really dangerous in 90% of shows. Maybe give more options in preference to have the choice, but please return us "Remember fader values" like Hog3 Os
"I need to check all pages before a show to check the values, because my I had left a fader up the night before in that song"
It makes no difference where the last position of that fader was when the show was saved, or the console shut down. These HTP faders are ALWAYS defaulting to full on console startup and show load.
This has bitten me twice during shows (once due to a console crash and a restart during the middle of the show!!) I think we really need to see some other options here to make the console safer to use. There are too many scenarios where the console will follow it's defaults, and output something to stage that you don't want.
+1 to everything that has been said by others here.
This gets even uglier when "+ Go Off Zero" is selected as a cuelist option.
I've had the same issue on 2 different shows myself and found the same "workaround" as Marc to visit every Page and adjust the levels, but as previously mentioned logging on/off or powering up "undoes" this and you have to go back and repeat it all over.....or put a whole host of Comment Macros into the Page to keep the faders at zero.
Long story short "Remeber Fader Values" set to OFF should be exactly that.....Don't store any value for the fader, and default to whatever the physical position is (if there is no physical position...such as not assigned to a Master, then "position" should be full).
If I want the console to use any value other than where the physical fader is set then I will turn ON "Remember Fader Values".
hey Guys just launched the first day of a small corporate event with my Roadhog4. I am new to HOG!!
During the Lunch break i logged out an in again to change the daytime. After beeing in my show again i started out with my main page, which was the first one. During the event i had to change a value from a master that was on page two. So i changed the page and Baaaammmm.....all Fader set to 100.
I was like...."What the Hell?"....
Then i remember myself that i read this thread yesterday and was trying to reproduce that after the show.
So...here is what i found out for me: ONLY AFTER i joined my show (restart/logout...whatever) all fader are set to 100. After pulling them down they will no longer go to 100 when i do a pagechange.
So here is my question: 1. is that the case, that this ONLY HAPPENS when launching the show? (so that i know whats the problem)
2. whats the idea behind that? I don't get it! I try to imagine when you have a bunch of pages in your show and have to reloggin during the event cause of some reasons. WHAT THEN when relaunching the show? You cannot change all pages and set the faders to 0 while in middle of the show.
If this is really the case (???) why not implement this in the preferences? So that you can choose what the faders ought to do, when you start a show..... 1.at full....2.at 0....3.at last value..or so.
Thank you everyone for your feedback in this issue. As part of Hog 4 OS Version 1.2.0 we are going to make it so that the physical fader position of a physical master will always win if the list is release and remember fader values is turned off. This will be the same functionality as users became accustomed to in the Hog 3 OS.
In the meantime, if you want a fader value to win at a certain level on a page change in the Hog 4 OS then it is best to use "remember activity" in conjunction with FM comment macros on your pages to set your fader values for each page.
