Hog3PC v3.0.1 9b 2425) Fixtures not shutting down

dpfreakdpfreak Registered User
Hello, we recently upgraded to b 2425 and we now have an issue where our Xspots won't shutdown when we quit the show and application. It seems that they are still getting DMX, upon further investigation our Widget will sit there with the TX Mode and Link lighst lit along with the DMX Ok light blinking after we exit and quit the show.

If we shutdown and restart the PC the problem seems to go away until we launch the show. We have activites all thoughout the week so the PC is seldom turned off, this along with the phantom DMX issue has added hundreds of additional hours to our Xspot bulbs. We have done the control shutdown method for the Xspots but they never come back up, global reset, lamp strike, unless we power cycle them by climbing up into the catwalk.

Help!

Comments

  • edited February 2009
    Starting with version 3.0.0 all DMX output devices, including widgets, have a DMX keepalive. The output device will hold up the last look with a 2 Hz refresh for as long as it has power.

    In older versions, different DMX output devices had different behavior. There's been a lot of discussion about what is the "correct" behavior. We standardized on a keepalive for a few reasons:
    1: It allows you to log off of one show and load another without having to restrike lamps.
    2: If the 3PC software crashes, your stage will still have light until you can restart the application.
    3: It was better to have consistant behavior across the line that different behavior from various products (I believe the DP2000 has a 6 Hz keepalive rather than 2 Hz).

    You're best bet is to write a shutdown cue that douses the lamps on all of your fixtures.

    We've considered adding a "Shutdown DMX option" to the dialog box that comes up when you quit the software. It may be added in the future, but for now the only way to stop DMX is to remove power from the widget or DP.

    The Xspot should respond to a reset when it's in shutdown. Make sure your intensity channel is at zero and that you're holding the control channel at the proper value for several seconds. If it's still not working, give support a call. They know the Xspot operation much better than I do.
  • tedcooktedcook Registered User
    edited February 2009
    Just curious, does this new behavior for widgets affect the way the iPC works, as it is using a super widget? I can log off and maintain last output?

    thanks.
  • edited February 2009
    > does this new behavior for widgets affect the way the
    > iPC works ... I can log off and maintain last output?

    Yes.

    There will be a momentary interruption in DMX output (about 1 second) when the virtual DP comes online for the new show, but most fixtures won't even notice.

    You should even be able to reboot the console and still have output. The exception to this is the Single Universe Widget. Since they rely on the USB port for power, it may stop DMX refresh when you reboot. Some computers remove power from the USB port during a reboot, some don't, it depends on your specific machine.
  • jxgriffijxgriffi Registered User, DL Beta, Hog Beta
    edited February 2009
    Along this same line Eric...a Fleenor Preset-10 will not kick in unless it sees a "loss of DMX." We lost the functionality with this because of the keep-alive (DP's are kept on). We used a Preset-10 for houselights and presets of conventionals without the use of the console. I'll have to rethink this and see if I can include a DP shutdown....

    hmmmm....
  • edited February 2009
    This kind of over-ride/take control stuff is usually the domain of an architectural control system. What kind of dimmers do you have? Can they take multiple DMX inputs?

    A DMX merger, Priority Override, or similar would also work. If you like the Preset 10, the DFD Preset 10-2 should do what you need.
  • dpfreakdpfreak Registered User
    edited February 2009
    How about an option to turn Keep Alive off on the next revision?

    Here is my issue, we have an ECS lighting system, 144 Channels, Muliple DMX inputs (not used), 8 line DMX Distribution System, and ECS touch screen controllers. Any DMX input overides Auxilery Controllers, but the Main Controller overrides any input ECS system or DMX. The system has its on keepalive built in, so if there is signal loss everything stays at the last know setting. The DMX Distibution System will hold the last known DMX signal for 300 Seconds upon signal loss, it drops after that.
    Since the Keepalive, the DMX keeps pining and the Xspots never see a DMX drop so they stay active when they need to go off. We thought about wiring in a remote switch to cut power to them but I really don't want to do that becuase the fans need to run for a while after the buld shuts off. They are hung 30ft off the floor from the bottom of a catwalk, the only way to get to them is with a lift. We have access to the power cords and I can reach the controls from the catwalk, but bulb changing is a nightmare.

    I see the point of Keep alive for a concert or field event where the Murphy rules, but we really don't need this feature in a church installation.

    Additionaly we have issues with both of our X-Spots not restarting after a Control Shutdown, even if we run Global Reset they will not restart or restrike the lamps. The Screens continue to show Shutdown and we have to physically power them down, unplug, and plug them back up.

    Thanks,

    Shaun
  • jxgriffijxgriffi Registered User, DL Beta, Hog Beta
    edited February 2009
    This kind of over-ride/take control stuff is usually the domain of an architectural control system. What kind of dimmers do you have? Can they take multiple DMX inputs?

    A DMX merger, Priority Override, or similar would also work. If you like the Preset 10, the DFD Preset 10-2 should do what you need.

    It's an older Sensor system (15+ years) and no architectural system was implemented. I am putting in a Cueserver to take over the details that the Preset-10 was handling to get rid of having to use it inline and, thus, bypass the always active state.
  • edited February 2009
    > if we run Global Reset they will not
    > restart or restrike the lamps.

    Contact Supprt, they'll help you work out why your X-spots won't respond to a reset when they are in shutdown. That's the correct way to solve this issue. Our support team has a bunch of great people who really know the products.
  • edited February 2009
    > It's an older Sensor system (15+ years)

    Most Sensor install racks have multiple DMX input and can mix them on an HTP or priority-override basis. Some of the smaller racks used the "MPE" control module that isn't quite a powerful, but the CEM can definately handle it.
  • kevinj.lawsonkevinj.lawson Registered User
    edited February 2009
    So just to clarify. I have a RHFB in a church installation with a Unison Architechtural system. When I upgrade to 3.0 the RH will keep alive the DMX output even after the board is powered down? I don't see this being a problem because I'm in the habit of clearing everything before i shutdown but because this is different that anything else we have had in the building before I don't know how the Unison system will respond. I think an option in the next build to disable the keep alive feature would be convenient but I also can see that being a hassel to implement.
  • edited February 2009
    > DMX output even after the board is powered down?

    If you're using the 4 internal outputs on the RHFB, it will stop sending DMX when the console is powered down.
  • jxgriffijxgriffi Registered User, DL Beta, Hog Beta
    edited February 2009
    Kevin, it only effects those that keep a widget, superwidget, or DP powered up. Shutting down the console does indeed shut down the DMX line and Unison will be fine.
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