DMX 8000 Processor as Artnet node

rbrighamrbrigham Registered User, Hog Beta
Are there any plans to have the DMX 8000 Processor act as an Artnet node, as the DP2000 does? I can see this being useful in a few (rare) instances.

-RB

Comments

  • edited January 2009
    Unlikely. The DP8000 would be an extraordinarily overpowered Art-Net node.
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Out of curiosity, what application? It already spits out artnet without a special mode.
  • Marty PostmaMarty Postma Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Correct, but the DP-2000s have a mode now that allows them to input ArtNet (instead of HogNet) and output 5-Pin DMX.

    I agree with Eric on this one.....seems like a phenominal misallocation of resources to use a DP-8K as an ArtNet output node......it can't possibly be cost effective!
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Ah, I see. :footinmouth:

    Well, with that in mind it would be cool if you could assign outputs on the 8000 individually to either hog or artnet. How bout them apples?:D
  • Marty PostmaMarty Postma Registered User
    edited January 2009
    you already can.....simply open the Network status window....select your DP-8K....then select settings.....;)
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    :footinmouth: :footinmouth:

    Ok , I need to get my hands on one of these before I spout off any more.
    But in my mind that means the answer to the OP's question is that the feature is already built in, yes?
  • Joe BleasdaleJoe Bleasdale Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Lekolite wrote:
    :footinmouth: :footinmouth:

    Ok , I need to get my hands on one of these before I spout off any more.
    But in my mind that means the answer to the OP's question is that the feature is already built in, yes?

    Maybe the OP meant to say... Have 1 crossover cable from the console, conneted to an ethernet hub/switch, then have the DP8Ks in the rig outputting art-net.
  • Marty PostmaMarty Postma Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Lekolite wrote:
    :footinmouth: :footinmouth:

    Ok , I need to get my hands on one of these before I spout off any more.
    But in my mind that means the answer to the OP's question is that the feature is already built in, yes?

    No.

    Let's make sure we are talking about the same thing here.

    You can set any one of the DP-8Ks available 16 universes to be transmitted over ArtNet. While any 8 of them can be assigned to the DMX 5-pin ports on the front. The total number of unique universes cannot be greater than 16 per processor though.

    The above refers to what to do when your fixtures on the other side need to recieve 5-pin DMX (ie - cannot take ArtNet directly) when you are only sending ArtNet...no 5-pin cables are run between the console and the fixtures. You need a converter of some sort in this case. Using a DP-8K as a converter seems like an aweful waste to me personally.
  • bradpepebradpepe Registered User, HES Alumni
    edited January 2009
    The suggestion to put the same functionality into the DP8000 as the D2000 was logged a while back from a user suggestion. While it is overkill, the suggestion is valid and has been logged.
  • rbrighamrbrigham Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited January 2009
    Hello all.

    I totally agree that that DMX8000 would be a real waste if used solely as an artnet node. But so is the DP2000; that is also a way overpowered artnet node.

    My Hognet processors are currently located remotely in the dimmer/data room. I am just thinking that on the shows visiting my venue that carry their own console, I'd rather have them go artnet into my existing processors than run a 7 universe snake.

    I don't know how involved it would be to port the functionality over from the DP2000, so it was just a suggestion.

    -RB
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Marty, I should have been more clear.

    I meant have the 8k's physical 5 pin outputs individually assignable as either hog from the HogIII or artnet from an external artnet source. Is that what you meant is currently possible? What I had understood up till now is that the 8k will send a HogIII output over artnet cat5, but that means one of its physical 5-pin outputs is doing nothing now.

    I currently have a recurring use for this scenario, where I need just one or possibly 2 physical outputs for an artnet source and am not using all of the hognet outputs. This would make the 8k that much more awesome.
  • Marty PostmaMarty Postma Registered User
    edited January 2009
    rbrigham wrote:
    My Hognet processors are currently located remotely in the dimmer/data room. I am just thinking that on the shows visiting my venue that carry their own console, I'd rather have them go artnet into my existing processors than run a 7 universe snake.

    Well I guess it does make sense in that scenario....as Brad says, it is logged.
    Lekolite wrote:
    What I had understood up till now is that the 8k will send a HogIII output over artnet cat5, but that means one of its physical 5-pin outputs is doing nothing now.

    Not entirely true.
    Lekolite wrote:
    I currently have a recurring use for this scenario, where I need just one or possibly 2 physical outputs for an artnet source and am not using all of the hognet outputs. This would make the 8k that much more awesome.

    The DP-8K can handle 16 Universes. It only has 8 DMX 5-pin ports.....so you can have 8 ArtNet Universes plus 8 DMX 5-pin Universes or any combination thereof. The only time you would "lose" a 5-pin port is if you need more than 8 Universes of ArtNet (ie - 12 ArtNet Universes and 4 DMX 5-pin)
  • rbrighamrbrigham Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited January 2009
    And while we are on the subject of making an already incredible processor even more flexable and robust, what happened to the beer tap?

    -RB
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    The DP-8K can handle 16 Universes. It only has 8 DMX 5-pin ports.....so you can have 8 ArtNet Universes plus 8 DMX 5-pin Universes or any combination thereof. The only time you would "lose" a 5-pin port is if you need more than 8 Universes of ArtNet (ie - 12 ArtNet Universes and 4 DMX 5-pin)

    Isn't there an expansion box to get the additional 8 5-pin ports? And thats still not addressing my dream of having the 8k turn 5-pin port #8 into a physical output for my other artnet source.
  • Marty PostmaMarty Postma Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Yes there is an optional (it doesn't come standard) expansion box for the DP-8K to make all 16 outputs 5-pin. It hooks up to the USB in the rear of the DP-8K.

    Alternatively you could hook up DMX super-widgets or single widgets as well to get the extra 8 universes to be 5-pin.

    I can't see why you would generate ArtNet from another source and input it into the DP-8K?!? Why not then just generate it with the DP-8K to begin with?

    If you need a single universe ArtNet to DMX box, there are some out there for a few hundred bucks.....a DP-8K will cost you thousands.....doesn't make any sense, financially or in terms of signal flow.
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Because the other artnet device is not a hog. Ok fine, here's my example:

    Hog controlling moving and conventional rig using 6 universes.
    Part of this rig is a pixelmad setup using an axon as the video source.
    Pixelmad spits out artnet. I need the universes that pixelmad is spitting out in 2 locations. One of them is in dimmerworld where my 8k is.

    Signalflow Ascii art:
            [LED walls]                            Pixelmad>-Artnet->- 
                 ^                                     ^              |
                5-pin                                Video            |
                 ^                                     ^              |
    [hog]>-net->[8k]>-5-pin->[conventionals, movers, axons]           |
                 ^                                                    |
                 |                                                    |
                 ^                                                    |
            [net switch]-----------------------------------------------
                \/
                |
                 >[other artnet output]>5-pin>[Led Walls]
    

    There's 10 minutes i'll never get back.:aargh4:

    I guess bottom line, I would like the 8k to be able to spit out an art net universe (From another source) over 5-pin. It is a feature I would find useful. YMMV.:cool:
  • Marty PostmaMarty Postma Registered User
    edited January 2009
    OK....so your video walls do not "speak" ArtNet natively then?

    I'm curious as to what type of LED wall you are using that only has 5-pin DMX.....sounds like a serious design flaw to me?!?
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Custom set pieces made with various Color kinetics fixtures.
  • rbrighamrbrigham Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited January 2009
    Just remember that Brad says it is already logged, so my original request is answered.....

    My Hog and DP8k are currently installed in a permanent venue, the Hog at FOH and the DP hidden in a rack in a completely seperate room. The link between them is a CAT6 run in the wall. This, of course, works well for the shows I design and program, and most of the tours also.

    The problem comes with the few shows that bring their own console. With my Hog network, the actual DMX generating device is located remotely, so all of the DMX distribution is also remote. So to accept a touring console, I have to run a 7 universe snake from FOH to the remote room. It would seem ideal to me that during these shows with touring consoles, I could fully replace my Hognet link between FOH and the DP8k with an artnet link between the DP8k and the touring console outputting Artnet natively. I would still be using my exisiting in-wall cabeling, normal dmx distribution, and DP8k as the central hub of the network.

    I agree it would be foolish to buy a DMX 8000 Processor to act only as an 8-port artnet node. Just as it would be foolish to buy a DP2k to only be a 4-port arnet node. The added functionality sinply makes the processor that much more flexible and robust.

    Seriously, though, what happened to the beer tap? Brad, is that logged? A retrofit maybe?

    -RB
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    RB, I totally agree. I am also tagging onto your post to add a request of my own. In my solution its not a seperate mode, the 8k is still running 'normally', but you can turn some of the hard outputs into artnet outputs. I am also not going to buy an 8k just for this purpose. If we already own the hardware, its silly to not take advantage of it.
  • rbrighamrbrigham Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited January 2009
    Just to clarify, though, my request is still Artnet input, not output.

    The DP8k should already be doing Artnet output along with the "normal" DMX output. It has two RJ-45 jacks on the back, one for Hognet (input, from console) and one for Artnet (output, to devices). You can use the 8 dmx outputs and artnet concurrently right now!

    -RB
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    That is my request too. I want the 8k to be able to take art net in from a non hog source and send it out one of the 5 pin connectors on the front. I just want to be able to do it one port at a time instead of all or none like the 2k does now.
  • Marty PostmaMarty Postma Registered User
    edited January 2009
    I believe the ArtNet mode that is logged will put the DP-8K into an "all-or-none" mode similar to the DP-2K......not sure how hard it would be to add in functionality like this....or that it makes sense to do so.

    I do think that this would over-complicate a system and make it very difficult to troubleshoot signal flow problems. For your above example I think you would be much better off using a box such as this one:

    http://www.enttec.com/index.php?main_menu=Products&pn=70305&show=description&name=ode

    And bypass the DP-8K entirely for your video signal.
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    I fail to see how simply changing the direction that artnet flows through the hardware complicates signal flow that much. It is no more complicated planning for this use of the 8k than it is to plan for the 8k to transmit artnet from a system tech's point of view. If there is some hardware hurdle that makes this approach impractical then I accept that. If you do not like my idea, I accept that. I, however, like my idea and think it would help the Hog platform grow and be more useful to everyone.

    I would like for Brad to weigh in and let me know if this has been brought up and killed already.
  • bradpepebradpepe Registered User, HES Alumni
    edited January 2009
    To be honest, we have not discussed this feature set at all, other than my logging it. There are many other requests that present a much higher value to more customers way ahead of converting the DP8000 to an Art-Net node.

    All the discussion and suggestions in this thread are linked to the feature suggestion log so they will not be lost when we do make decisions about this feature.

    We appeciate the opinions and suggestions of all users, because everyone works with our equipment in unique ways and we want to please as many as we can.

    thanks for your understanding,
  • LekoliteLekolite Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Thanks Brad.
  • rbrighamrbrigham Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited January 2009
    Thanks Brad.
  • viperwareviperware Registered User
    edited November 2009
    What about pixel mapping? I have a fancy media server that allows you to pixel map video to a dmx matrix and transmit those values over artnet. The fixtures are Jarag-5 units in a 4x4 square giving me a 20x20 matrix. So that leaves me with dmx information on a cat 5 cable that I would like to transmit to my dmx 5-pin controlled jarag-5's. I am already controlling the media server via artnet with the hog, I need to get the pixelmap information from the media server back into the hog to give the lights that dmx info. Basically I want to patch the information on artnet subnet 1 universe 1 to dmx output 1 on the DP8K (or full boar, right?), but from what I understand from the information in this post, the DP8K does not do full duplex artnet. Am I missing something here or is pixelmapping not possible without additional hardware? This should be high on the priority list of updates.
    -p-
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