bi-directional lighting control protocol (wow that´s a mouthful)

snowmansnowman Registered User
I know this has come up several times but for the sake of all those who have no idea what i´m talking about ill say it all again:D.

how would you guys like to see implemented a bi-directional lighting control protocol. So you just would plug in your DMX, ArtNet, HogNet (what is that btw?) and the fixtures would talk to the console and tell it what it was and how many channels it uses, what channels do what and so on . . . . . . . . . . .essentially meaning that you could forget about patching altogether. and if the fixture tells the console what its footprint is the whole problem of fixture librarys would cease to exist

I know if ive got this wrong someone will correct me:footinmouth:

thoughts? ideas? suggestions? comments? pros and cons?

Comments

  • Joe BleasdaleJoe Bleasdale Registered User
    edited January 2009
    This already exists. It is called RDM. Remote Device Management. Some consoles and fixtures are "RDM ready". This doesnt mean they support it now, but they have the potential to support it when it is more widley implememted.

    Art-Net and Hog net.

    Art-Net is a protocal created by artistic licence. It is a network protocal used for transportation of DMX down one cat 5 cable. Multiple universes can go down one cable. E.G. your DP8000 can output Art-Net. INSDEAD of DMX. If you wish to learn more about Art-Net, google it, or buy a book called "rock solid ethernet." Its is written by the man who invented Art-Net. He also owns the company "Artistic licence".

    Hog net. Is the network protocal that Wholehogs, DPs etc use to comunicate. Not usually DMX. However in the case of the HOG 3 Hog net communicaates with the DP2000/8000 to output Art-Net or DMX.

    Does this make sense?
  • snowmansnowman Registered User
    edited January 2009
    more or less.

    how widespread is RDM? and is it automatic? like do you only have to connect everything and hit PATCH or CONNECT or something
  • Marty PostmaMarty Postma Registered User
    edited January 2009
    snowman wrote:
    more or less.

    how widespread is RDM? and is it automatic? like do you only have to connect everything and hit PATCH or CONNECT or something

    Not even that much....if you have ever worked with the DL.2/DL.3-CMA software or the SHOWPIX/StudioPIX-Echo software.....then you already have an idea of how RDM works.

    At the end of the day it's all how you interface via the software GUI.
  • quinnquinn Registered User
    edited January 2009
    snowman wrote:
    how widespread is RDM?

    i've found that it's my personal mission to consult against RDM.

    Fixture Talkback would have been great had it caught on back in the 1900's.

    today, every chance i get, i try to drive change orders in the direction of ACN.

    E1.33 is, in my opinion, very temporary and designed to facilitate incremental purchasing, and not actually provide a viable control strategy. it puts in place essential infrastructure, such as cabling, while allowing the "lesser" but existant RDM devices to participate in immediate staging activities.

    so, RDM if you must, but please, do it over ACN.
  • SBlairSBlair Registered User, HES Alumni
    edited January 2009
    RDM has been released for a couple years now. You are starting to see full support of it in a lot of new products. It is fully supported in SHOWPIX, StudioPix, SHOWGUN, and any new lights coming from HES. It is also in many Robe and I believe Martin fixtures now and dozens of other products. It is a true interoperable standard.

    Art-Net also includes support for RDM messaging so you can have full functionality there as well.

    Being the person that created Fixture Talkback and also the architect for RDM, the reason Fixture Talkback never got any traction was because it was a proprietary HES protocol. It was not an open protocol others could implement and it never even got fully implemented in Hog2 as Hog3 was already underway. RDM being a true ANSI Standard that had the involvement of a couple dozen people solves those problems.

    I believe Quinn is a bit misinformed on ACN. The promise of what ACN *could* do is great, but there are many pieces still missing that keep it from being a completed Standard. The core parts of it are released, but the portions necessary to provide true plug-and-play interoperability are missing. That and the complexity is why I believe the uptake of it has been slow. Just comparing the amount of gear at the trade shows that speaks RDM vs. ACN is evidence of that.

    Once E1.31 is released, that may end up being all the market really wants. I see lots of excitement for E1.31 but not for ACN itself.
  • quinnquinn Registered User
    edited January 2009
    SBlair wrote:
    I see lots of excitement for E1.31 but not for ACN itself.

    i'm out to make a difference.

    (kept up on the working group minutes, too)
  • SBlairSBlair Registered User, HES Alumni
    edited January 2009
    Quinn, trust me. There is a LOT more that goes on besides what makes it into the meeting minutes!
  • quinnquinn Registered User
    edited January 2009
    sounds kinda kinky
  • SBlairSBlair Registered User, HES Alumni
    edited January 2009
    Standards development meetings are masochistic than kinky!
  • edited January 2009
    If you're at all interested in control protocols, it's worth attending some of the ESTA Technical Standards Program meetings. They're great learning experiences, and once you get comfortable with how things work you can make valuable contributions. It's always good to have new blood and new ideas.

    I do recommend listening more than you talk for your first few times, but that's just good etiquette in any forum.
  • Joe BleasdaleJoe Bleasdale Registered User
    edited January 2009
    If you're at all interested in control protocols, it's worth attending some of the ESTA Technical Standards Program meetings. They're great learning experiences, and once you get comfortable with how things work you can make valuable contributions. It's always good to have new blood and new ideas.

    I do recommend listening more than you talk for your first few times, but that's just good etiquette in any forum.

    Can these be found on the ESTA website?
  • edited January 2009
    Meetings are usually 4 times a year
    http://www.esta.org/tsp/meetings/index.php
  • Joe BleasdaleJoe Bleasdale Registered User
    edited January 2009
    Thanks Eric, I will take a look.
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