Hogpc4 + Roadhog4 Backup

skierskier Registered User
edited June 2013 in Hog 4 Networking Help
Not sure If what we are trying to achieve is possible or we are doing something wrong.

We have a Roadhog 4 running a show & outputing Artnet. We want to use a HogPC4 to provide backup. This is also connected to the Artnet network. (it has widgets connected to enable Artnet)

We then link the 2 machines together via Hognet (seperate network) and depending if the console numbers are the same or different etc the Hogpc4 tracks or controls the show as you would expect.

Now for the BUT - if we disconnect the Roadhog from the network the Hogpc4 won't take control of the show. If we load the show directly to the Hogpc4 it works perfectly but seems unable to take over seamlessly from the Roadhog4.

Should we be able to seamlessly take over the show from the Roadhog with this type of setup?

Any thoughts on this appreciated!

Many thanks

S

Comments

  • lbohnlbohn Registered User
    edited June 2013
    Have you ensured that "Run Server" is enabled in Settings on the Hog4PC before connecting to the RoadHog?

    --L.
  • skierskier Registered User
    edited June 2013
    Yes I have.

    Regards

    S
  • MLorenzMLorenz Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited June 2013
    Are you using the same netnumber for the internal DPs?
    Have you patched your outputs to the same art-net universes, this might cause problems.

    Seamless would only work if you have an automatic switch from artnet output of the Roadhog to the HOGPC-System.
    There are switches like the ones from Luminex who provied this function or also other brands (spanning tree is the keyword)
    This means, you output artnet from both machines, the network-switch has one port configured as the "main" and an other as the "Spare", if the main input fails the switch changes after a set time to the spare input.
    In this case you will need also to configure your DPs the same way but with different net-numbers. If they have the same net-numbers one DP will always stay idle (which might be your problem here)

    To have a full tracking backup in your situation i would go for:
    Console net #1, internal DP #1
    PC net #1, internal DP #2
    clone DP #1 to DP #2
    Now the HOG PC will fully track the Console in Playback
    and now to the artnet-part
    get a progammable switch, and let some IT-cracks configure this for you like decribed above
    this will then switch your artnet if one of the Artnet-outs fails
    If one of the show-server fails the hog software will switch to the other server.
  • skierskier Registered User
    edited June 2013
    Thank you for taking the time to respond - That all makes complete sense!
  • Buzz313thBuzz313th Registered User
    edited June 2013
    Hey Marc,

    Why the need for a automatic switch? Won't the active DP send artnet packets and the idle dp not send packets? Then when the active DP goes offline, the idle DP goes active replicating the same patch?

    JB
  • MLorenzMLorenz Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited June 2013
    Hey JB,

    you are right... I only had the setup in my mind when this takeover function was not existing.
    Never tried it since then, cause the switches I use are already configured in that way so I stayed with my setup (never touch a running system)
  • srautanesrautane Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited June 2013
    Jeff, do you mean that backup solution with DPs with the same number works?
    How do you determine which one will be active or idle?
  • Buzz313thBuzz313th Registered User
    edited June 2013
    In theory that's how it's supposed to work as documented by HES. I have never tested the art net failover transfer, but I have watched the failover transfer on the network screen where if you take the active DP8000 process offline (Kill the process) then the system will try to switch and turn on the idle DP. Only I never tested it on a complete running network, so I don't know if the actual DP switch happened.

    In my quick experiments, it seemed like the first DPs logged onto the show became the active DPs and the last ones went idle.

    Maybe some of you can test if you have multiple DPs.
  • Buzz313thBuzz313th Registered User
    edited June 2013
    Well I did some quick tests with the following systems and checked raw DMX out with a swisson.

    FB4 b540 running everything on net1 ip at 101
    H4PC b540 running everything on net1 ip at 102
    No external dp's only internals with one widget attached to H4pc

    Created show on console at 101 and patched 10 desk channels to DP1/1

    Logged 102 into show at 101

    Both desks show two dp's in network screen with dp from 101 showing active and dp from 102 idle.

    Grabbed 1-10 at full and saved to 1/1 on 101. Ran Q 1/1. Consoles tracked.

    Killed the DP8000 process on 101 and watched dp101 go offline on the network screen.

    DP 102 did not come online and stayed idle. Confirmed two dead dp's with swisson.

    Killed console 101 and 102 took over the show as master. But it did not activate DP 102.

    I did a few more tests and noticed a few things that were inconsistent with show login and patch creation when two consoles/DP's are on the same net number. I think I need to experiment a bit more to get my head around whats going on...

    JB
  • srautanesrautane Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited June 2013
    That's something I expected...
    That's why I use different DP numbers and Luminex taking care of switching to active DP.
  • MLorenzMLorenz Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited June 2013
    srautane wrote: »
    That's something I expected...
    That's why I use different DP numbers and Luminex taking care of switching to active DP.


    Like I proposed...
    Cause this works great!!
    I dont know if this automatic takeover for DPs is something that only works with external DPs?!
    Never tried it and are so used to the other setup with Luminex or another managed switch.
  • mikeyraymikeyray Registered User
    edited June 2013
    what luminex unit do you use and how do you set this up ??
    I am looking at building a similar setup for an upcoming festival
    ta
    mikey
  • MLorenzMLorenz Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited June 2013
    http://www.luminex.be/products_details.php?cat=2&prod=0100048&display=description

    Thats the one I use
    Can do a lot more
    You can also use managed switches like HP ProCurves that support spanning tree and configure them to your needs (I cant, thats why I use the Luminex ;-) )
  • mikeyraymikeyray Registered User
    edited June 2013
    so its an easy thing to sort put with luminex ?
    only asking as ive never used luminex kit really
    m
  • MLorenzMLorenz Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited June 2013
    Yes very easy
    Easy to understand web-interface
  • MitchMitch Registered User, HES Alumni
    edited June 2013
    IDLE indicates the DP is connected to the console but it doesn't have anything patched to it.
  • foxriderfoxrider Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited June 2013
    MLorenz wrote: »
    You can also use managed switches like HP ProCurves that support spanning tree and configure them to your needs (I cant, thats why I use the Luminex ;-) )

    Hi Lorenz, do you mean using spanning tree with Artnet only? I remember some time ago, there was a thread in the forum stating that Hognet is not happy with spanning tree setup for redundancy. Wonder if anyone can confirm on this? I do not have enough gears to test this on my own.
  • MLorenzMLorenz Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited June 2013
    foxrider wrote: »
    Hi Lorenz, do you mean using spanning tree with Artnet only? I remember some time ago, there was a thread in the forum stating that Hognet is not happy with spanning tree setup for redundancy. Wonder if anyone can confirm on this? I do not have enough gears to test this on my own.


    I only used HP spanning tree with Artnet

    With Hognet I recently used this product:
    http://www.luminex.be/products_details.php?cat=2&prod=0100038&display=description

    1 at FoH, 1 at Dimmer-City,
    Connected via the 2 fibre ports.
    Worked great without any problems.
    I tried it with unplugging and replugging the 2 fibre lines
    No drops or so
  • foxriderfoxrider Registered User, Hog Beta
    edited June 2013
    MLorenz wrote: »
    I only used HP spanning tree with Artnet

    With Hognet I recently used this product:
    http://www.luminex.be/products_details.php?cat=2&prod=0100038&display=description

    1 at FoH, 1 at Dimmer-City,
    Connected via the 2 fibre ports.
    Worked great without any problems.
    I tried it with unplugging and replugging the 2 fibre lines
    No drops or so

    Thanks for the reply. It would also be great to hear from HES with regards to spamming tree for Hognet.
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